Threaded Mode | Linear Mode

r111 · (This post was last modified: 03-08-2010 05:42 PM by r111.)

I’m new to this forum. I knew open carry was legal in PA since I majored in criminal justice in 1990. I got a LTCF when I turned 21 and carried ever since. I never carried open before and would like to start, mostly in the summer because I would think it would be more comfortable. Since 1990 I knew most LEO just did not know the law on open carry. I live in the York area and I had a friend who walked into the west Manchester mall in 92 open carrying. The police were called and were informed; A MAN WITH A GUN was in the mall. The police responded with guns drawn and asked for a permit. The man stated he did not need a permit and the police stated, oh yes you do and arrested him and took him to the magistrate. The magistrate released him stating it was legal to open carry without a permit. I never wanted that Hassel. Of course I never had that problem with a CCW because obliviously no one knows you have a gun. I’m happy to see some of you are exersing your right to carry open. I would like to but at this time I’m just too nervous to do so.
I called my local police department today to see how well informed they are to the open carry law but I didn’t hear back yet. I called the local PSP barracks and talked to a trooper. The trooper was aware that it is legal to open carry but stated, if you are walking down town and people panic because you are wearing a gun then you are causing a disturbance and you could be charged as such. I know that wasn’t true but I did not call up to argue. He asked me what township I live in and I informed him I live in Manchester. He informed me to call the local police and stated, they may have township ordinances against open carry. I know a township cannot regulate that law but I didn’t want to get into a peeing contest with him. It upsets me that open carry is legal just as driving a car but because most of the public doesn’t know that law, the LEO wants to make you the criminal because some people panic when they see someone with open carry. The trooper also stated if it’s night time and you are walking up to a turkey hill wearing a gun, most people are going to assume you going to rob the store. How many criminals are going to walk around with a holster on their hip??????????? Most all criminals walk into a place carrying the weapon concealed and pull it when they are ready to commit the criminal act. I read that several of you carried several years without a problem, but my luck I would get questioned the first day open carrying. I brought the subject up at my local gun range who CCW and most of them seem against open carry stating, You will just make all gun owners look bad by open carry because most people will observe it as “looking for trouble” I disagree.

shooter357 · 03-08-2010, 07:20 PM

Where to start????

How about: I also wanted to ask a LEO what he/she thought about OC but then realized that I couldn't care less what THEY think or wanted to hear the shit that comes from their pie holes.

Quote:The trooper also stated if it’s night time and you are walking up to a turkey hill wearing a gun, most people are going to assume you going to rob the store. How many criminals are going to walk around with a holster on their hip???????????

I'm still wating for someone to show me one instance where a person was OC'ing and robbed someone or someplace.

Quote:I brought the subject up at my local gun range who CCW and most of them seem against open carry stating, You will just make all gun owners look bad by open carry because most people will observe it as “looking for trouble”....

People are stupid. These are the weekend warriors that fully support the 2ndA, as long as it suits them.

spencer280 · 03-08-2010, 09:25 PM

ya dont ask the police anything.; there going to give you the wrong answer or make false truths to fit there wants. and that thing where if people would panic and you could be charged is way wrong. you canot control others responses toward you carrying a weapon and you can not be charged... as long as you dont pull that weapon out and showing in public streets there is nothing they can do. he was just blowing smoke up your ass. you should have called him out on that one. just to let him now that you know the laws. take care man oc safely

Paradigm · 03-08-2010, 10:04 PM

Never ask LEOs for legal advice. Period.

You know it's legal, so act like it's legal. Don't ask permission to do legal things. By doing so, you are giving power to those who really are no different than you.

redeye202 · 03-09-2010, 10:31 AM

Ask them if they would arrest a person for open carry of a box,you know they could have a bomb in that box.
I asked this of a local leo and as if by majic he got my point about carrying any thing openly.

Xringshooter · 03-09-2010, 05:12 PM

(03-09-2010 10:31 AM)redeye202 Wrote: Ask them if they would arrest a person for open carry of a box,you know they could have a bomb in that box.

Redeye, that is a good one, I'll remember that one easy enough.

lee · (This post was last modified: 03-09-2010 08:33 PM by lee.)

Things are different now than they were in 1992. The 2009 manditory MPOETC 2009 update covers open carrying. Here's a scan of the part of the manual that covers OC.

http://www.lildobe.net/PAFOA_Docs/MPOTEC...e_2009.pdf

Pay particular attention to questions #3. Even though officers have had this yearly training update, there is no guarantee that they will respect the law and your rights. Combine the training update with the few (of varying publicity) lawsuits in PA where people were unlawfully detained/arrested and won their cases (and cash settlements), the legality is becoming more known whether they like it or not.

r111 · 03-10-2010, 12:59 AM

The lieutenant from the local police department called me back today. The Lt stated,”I received your message about open carry. Open carry is legal and our department respects the rights of gun owners to exercise their rights and that goes for open carry. If we receive MAN WITH A GUN CALL we will ask dispatch what the MAN WITH A GUN is doing. If the response is he is just wearing a gun, we will tell the caller it is legal to open carry. If the caller exaggerates the story, we will charge the caller for giving a false police report. I myself prefer to carry concealed when off duty because if a criminal is intent on robbing someone most likely he will try to take out the guy who is wearing the gun first, but that is just my personal opinion. Our department will not harass law abiding gun owners. “

lee · 03-10-2010, 01:05 AM

That is probably the most professional response anyone could have hoped for.

Paradigm · 03-10-2010, 09:54 AM

That is a good response...

Xringshooter · 03-10-2010, 09:51 PM

Well, not to be the skeptic (but I will be Smile

). That is the LT's response. What about the officer on the street?

flwo · 03-22-2010, 01:11 PM

Does anyone OC in York? I am new to the forum, and have been looking for people that OC in Wal-Mart or other stores, but haven't come accross any.

redeye202 · 03-22-2010, 09:43 PM

(03-22-2010 01:11 PM)flwo Wrote: Does anyone OC in York? I am new to the forum, and have been looking for people that OC in Wal-Mart or other stores, but haven't come accross any.

Welcome to the forum.
Go to PAFOA,become a member,learn all about OC in YORK from members who live there.

***Pa. Patriot*** · 03-23-2010, 09:51 AM

(03-10-2010 12:59 AM)r111 Wrote: The lieutenant from the local police department called me back today. The Lt stated,”I received your message about open carry. Open carry is legal and our department respects the rights of gun owners to exercise their rights and that goes for open carry. If we receive MAN WITH A GUN CALL we will ask dispatch what the MAN WITH A GUN is doing. If the response is he is just wearing a gun, we will tell the caller it is legal to open carry. If the caller exaggerates the story, we will charge the caller for giving a false police report. I myself prefer to carry concealed when off duty because if a criminal is intent on robbing someone most likely he will try to take out the guy who is wearing the gun first, but that is just my personal opinion. Our department will not harass law abiding gun owners. “

Sounds like someone took their 2009 MPOETC training update seriously Wink

That response is almost verbatim one of the paragraphs in the training update.

Paradigm · 03-23-2010, 10:36 AM

(03-10-2010 12:59 AM)r111 Wrote: I myself prefer to carry concealed when off duty because if a criminal is intent on robbing someone most likely he will try to take out the guy who is wearing the gun first, but that is just my personal opinion.

I love this line. It quotes the mysterious "Hollywood Scenario" where bad guys scan the area, then carefully and methodically go about the assault. In real life, there is virtually no proof that this has ever happened. Psychological research has shown that thugs have tunnel vision and focus specifically and intently on the target: the cash register or intended victim.